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IDProjectCategoryView StatusDate SubmittedLast Update
0001548ScribusUser Interfacepublic05-Jan-16 12:3410-Feb-19 16:30
Reporteralexandre 
Assigned Tocbradney 
PrioritynormalSeverityminorReproducibilityalways
StatusclosedResolutionfixed 
PlatformOSOS Version
Product Version1.3.0cvs 
Target Version1.5.0Fixed in Version1.5.0svn 
Summary0001548: Redesign of Preferences - Guides
DescriptionSummary of proposed changes:

1. Items are (re)grouped.
2. Other baseline settings are moved to this tab from "Typography".
3. Some items are moved to "Display" tab. See separate bug report for details.
TagsNo tags attached.
Attached Filespng file icon preferences_guides.png [^] (30,561 bytes) 05-Jan-16 12:34


png file icon fix.png [^] (126,638 bytes) 05-Apr-04 18:31


png file icon fix2.png [^] (87,851 bytes) 05-Apr-07 18:19


pdf file icon Typography.pdf [^] (13,255 bytes) 05-Apr-08 12:49
pdf file icon Guides.pdf [^] (13,568 bytes) 05-Apr-08 12:50

- Relationships
related to 0000512closedsubik Better guide dialog 
related to 0003837acknowledged Metabug: Master pages/Page templates 
child of 0002935acknowledgedsubik Metabug: Guide Dialog 

-  Notes
(0003486)
cbradney (administrator)
05-Jan-16 16:05

Nice!!
(0004066)
alexandre (developer)
05-Apr-04 18:23

Please take a look at the image I will post right after reopening this issue.
(0004070)
louisdesjardins (developer)
05-Apr-04 20:07

It's very nice indeed!
And it's very clear!
Agree with Option 2 in fix.png.
For the currently opened prefs tab, also agree it's not a "showstopper" but would be cool if it was adressed. I'd go with the 1st proposal but I guess any clear and neat way to achieve this would do it.

Footnote: I think all the controls for the baseline grid should be in one tab (Guide OR Typography) so you turn it on/off AND you define its color and spacing in the same dialog. :)

Add'l footnote: If the baseline grid spacing value could show up in the Paragraph Style dialog (as a reminder) lots of people would benefit from that little info, imo. :)
(0004071)
plinnell (administrator)
05-Apr-04 22:48

tested. Fixed. Thanks Alexandre for the sharp eye.. It looks and works consistently.
(0004109)
alexandre (developer)
05-Apr-07 18:18

Sorry guys :)

Reopening it again... :)
(0004110)
louisdesjardins (developer)
05-Apr-07 19:27

About the baseline grid, the "Grid ON/OFF" option has been changed to "Show baseline grid".
These are 2 different things. :)

Question: do you think it's the best place to select wether we want guides and grids to show/don't show since we have that already in View menu and in right click context menu?

IMO the prefs should be just that: how we want the grid and guides set. Wether we want to see them or not mostly depends on where we're up to designing or layouting the page.

Wouldn't that dissipate the possible confusion about the baseline grid (active or not, show or not)?

I think we have to be careful not forcing the user to do too many trips into the prefs dialog, once the work has started. :)
(0004111)
alexandre (developer)
05-Apr-07 19:57

Louis, there really is a page grid and a baseline grid, so I don't actually understand what you are trying to tell me :)

As for you question, "do you think it's the best place to select wether we want guides and grids to show/don't show since we have that already in View menu and in right click context menu?", yes I think it is because here we define *default* state of both grids visibility for any new document (except the ones from templates).

There should be a) defualt and b) customized states of any property. Default is what a user sees when he starts his work. Custom is what he does then. We are not talking about a definite document's properties dialog. We are talking about application's defaults. These are two different things :)
(0004122)
louisdesjardins (developer)
05-Apr-07 22:10

Hi Alexandre,

>Louis, there really is a page grid and a baseline grid, so I don't actually understand what you are >trying to tell me :)

Yes. I know that. In the first part of my note I talk about the baseline grid. As it used to be (none of the files you submitted here show that option) we could turn the grid on or off (in other words, activate it or not). This is different from actually seeing or not that same baseline grid. In other words, the baseline grid can be activated and invisible or vice versa.

Maybe it has been decided that the grid would always be active or "on". Then the only option would be through the Edit > Paragraph Style ---> [ ] Adjust to baseline grid.
If that's what it is, then I'm fine with it because I think it's simpler. User define the grid and it's automatically active. It only has an effect on any stylesheet when the option is checked in the stylesheet dialog. So only one place to check. No back and forth to the Prefs dialog.

Sorry for the labourious explanation. :)

The reason for my note was mainly to point this out because it was different than before. Could have been something forgotten.
(0004148)
alexandre (developer)
05-Apr-08 08:52

Louis, I still cease to understand you :)

Do you want both grids to be able be (invisible + active) or (inactive + visible)?
(0004179)
louisdesjardins (developer)
05-Apr-08 12:48

I am not talking about any other grid than the baseline grid! :)
I'll upload 2 screenshot from previous Scribus version so you'll understand better what I mean.
(0004180)
alexandre (developer)
05-Apr-08 12:59

So what is your proposal?

To make baseline grid be able to be enabled or disabled, whether it is visible or not?
(0004181)
cbradney (administrator)
05-Apr-08 13:24

Yes, baseline grid should be able to be enabled whether it is visible or not. The guides etc should all be able to be invisible but usable.
(0004182)
louisdesjardins (developer)
05-Apr-08 13:36

Now, I think I found the reason for the confusion and misunderstanding!!!

You can see in the guides.pdf file that I just uploaded that the Baseline Grid can be set to "on" or "off".
I just tested to find out that this has nothing to do with the Baseline Grid being actually "on" or "off" in the sense of activated/de-activated but with "show/hide grid". How could I possibly figure this out?! I always turn the Baseline Grid "on" as default behaviour, then I go the View menu if I want to hide it or not.

I checked with other languages and they basically have all followed the English version. This is misleading, imo.

I was under the impression that this on/off option was independant from the display. This is why I posted the comment on this grid being possibly "on" and "invisible" or "on" and "visible".

What lead me to believe this was:
1. The use of words on/off instead of show/hide in the Prefs dialog, while Major/Minor Grid don't have this option. So the question is raised: why should one believe on/off has to do with show/hide?
2. The fact that in the View menu you can show/hide the Baseline Grid AND the Major/Minor Grid

I hope you understand now!

Please take a look at the 2 screenshots I uploaded and you'll see the difference with what you are proposing now. Your idea is far better imo. And no, I don't think user should have the option to turn on/off the baseline grid (in the sense activate/de-activate) because they can already do so in the Style dialog.

If I understand well, Baseline Grid now works like the following:
1. The Baseline Grid is always turned on.
2. You set the linespacing (and color and show/hide + the default Automatic Linespace in %) of that Grid in the Prefs menu.
3. Wether you want that Baseline Grid to show/hide is also up to you in the View menu (default was set in Prefs).
4. When defining a Stylesheet, you have the option to have your text stick to that Baseline Grid or not.
5. Wether the lines stick to the Baseline Grid or not is not affected by the Baseline Grid to show or hide.
Is this all OK with you?
(0004186)
alexandre (developer)
05-Apr-08 14:40

cbradney: I disagree, that "guides etc." should all be able to be invisible but usable. This was previously discussed in inkscape-devel.
(0004187)
cbradney (administrator)
05-Apr-08 15:41

Whether you disagree or not, baseline grid must be able to be on, even if not viewed. Its a text formatting issue and you might not want it in the way when working but still want your text to be aligned to the baseline grid.
(0004190)
louisdesjardins (developer)
05-Apr-08 17:01

Yes Craig. Absolutely. Seeing the grid is meant to help visualize. It has nothing to do with the functionality and must not compromise the usage of the grid. I thought we all agreed on that.

My point end up narrowing to the choice of words for the grid to be seen or not. Show/Hide in this instance is clearer than On/Off (if it is meant to mean the same thing)...
That's what brought up confusion, imo.

At that point, I am back to my very last note posted (with the 1-2-3-4-5 points).
Do we agree on these points?
(0004226)
cbradney (administrator)
05-Apr-10 23:00

I've committed the name change of the label from Show Baseline Grid to Color:, Ive removed the margin so it lines up with the label now (other tabs need doing still). Baseline settings should NOT be disabled if the grid isnt shown.
(0004227)
cbradney (administrator)
05-Apr-10 23:39

Fixed the rest of the margins.
(0004229)
alexandre (developer)
05-Apr-11 08:18

kay, let it be the way you want ;) Scribus users tend to immediately complain about things they dislike

- Issue History
Date Modified Username Field Change
05-Jan-16 12:34 alexandre New Issue
05-Jan-16 12:34 alexandre File Added: preferences_guides.png
05-Jan-16 16:05 cbradney Note Added: 0003486
05-Jan-16 22:51 fschmid Status new => resolved
05-Jan-16 22:51 fschmid Fixed in Version => 1.3.0cvs
05-Jan-16 22:51 fschmid Resolution open => fixed
05-Jan-16 22:51 fschmid Assigned To => fschmid
05-Jan-16 22:56 cbradney View Status private => public
05-Mar-26 23:14 cbradney Status resolved => closed
05-Apr-04 18:23 alexandre Status closed => feedback
05-Apr-04 18:23 alexandre Resolution fixed => reopened
05-Apr-04 18:23 alexandre Note Added: 0004066
05-Apr-04 18:31 alexandre File Added: fix.png
05-Apr-04 20:07 louisdesjardins Note Added: 0004070
05-Apr-04 22:36 fschmid Status feedback => resolved
05-Apr-04 22:36 fschmid Resolution reopened => fixed
05-Apr-04 22:48 plinnell Note Added: 0004071
05-Apr-04 22:48 plinnell Status resolved => closed
05-Apr-07 18:18 alexandre Assigned To fschmid => plinnell
05-Apr-07 18:18 alexandre Status closed => feedback
05-Apr-07 18:18 alexandre Resolution fixed => reopened
05-Apr-07 18:18 alexandre Note Added: 0004109
05-Apr-07 18:19 alexandre File Added: fix2.png
05-Apr-07 19:27 louisdesjardins Note Added: 0004110
05-Apr-07 19:57 alexandre Note Added: 0004111
05-Apr-07 22:10 louisdesjardins Note Added: 0004122
05-Apr-08 08:52 alexandre Note Added: 0004148
05-Apr-08 12:48 louisdesjardins Note Added: 0004179
05-Apr-08 12:49 louisdesjardins File Added: Typography.pdf
05-Apr-08 12:50 louisdesjardins File Added: Guides.pdf
05-Apr-08 12:59 alexandre Note Added: 0004180
05-Apr-08 13:24 cbradney Note Added: 0004181
05-Apr-08 13:36 louisdesjardins Note Added: 0004182
05-Apr-08 14:40 alexandre Note Added: 0004186
05-Apr-08 15:41 cbradney Note Added: 0004187
05-Apr-08 17:01 louisdesjardins Note Added: 0004190
05-Apr-10 23:00 cbradney Note Added: 0004226
05-Apr-10 23:39 cbradney Note Added: 0004227
05-Apr-11 08:18 alexandre Note Added: 0004229
05-May-22 19:48 plinnell Status feedback => assigned
05-May-22 19:48 plinnell Assigned To plinnell => fschmid
05-Jun-28 21:03 plinnell Category - => User Interface
05-Sep-23 06:13 ringerc Relationship added related to 0000512
05-Dec-30 09:59 subik Relationship added child of 0002935
06-May-18 20:59 christoph_s Relationship added related to 0003837
08-Apr-21 22:25 cbradney Assigned To fschmid => cbradney
08-Apr-21 22:26 cbradney Target Version => 1.3.6
10-Feb-18 13:10 cbradney Status assigned => resolved
10-Feb-18 13:10 cbradney Fixed in Version 1.3.0cvs => 1.5.0svn
10-Feb-18 13:10 cbradney Resolution reopened => fixed
10-Feb-19 16:30 cbradney Status resolved => closed



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